Consumer Reports

[Cosmos36]

Fred...many thanks for a candid review of the early MKX production scenario at Oakville from an insiders perspective. Frankly, from reading some of the line employees narratives on social media during the early startup months, I couldn't help but feel both some anger and empathy. Many of them were sadly expressive, but humor and resolution under the circumstances was present also. Your last sentence says it all.

[akirby]

MKC production is in Louisville

[walkabout]

Yes line 22 is accurate. I don't want to say too much about the initial production of the re designed Edge and MKX. I don't want to implicate anyone at the plant. But Cosmos and Line 22 gives you a tale of a multitude of issues. Remember, my vehicle was built Nov 15 and it was one of 100s that were housed to correct numerous faults. Some assembly and some supply and supplier defects. I drove by a few times during initial builds and couldn't believe the scale and numbers of MKXs filing every sq inch of outside space.

 

They had a number of challenges. They opened the line with a re-designed Edge for NA market, along with a European model with different engine options (diesel) RH drive etc. Without much time to smooth out the kinks with that change they dropped in the totally new MKX. They all run on the same line, same workers, same everything. So that one line is building Edge, MKX, Flex. There were air bag shortages, electric steering defects from the supplier, A-pillar leaks, power control issues draining batteries etc. Train allocations dried up due to rail car shortages. My friend said every day had a new issue. Pressure was extreme due to the sales of the Edge globally and MKX for NA and China. The plant was a bees nest 24 hrs a day. My friend practically sleeps at his post to this day. Never saw his family at Can Thanksgiving (Oct). 

 

I'm not sure where the MKC is built but have to wonder if they went thru similar teething.

 

Any quality complaints with the first batch of vehicles is probably justified. Like my friend said one day he was building years of unchanged Edges, MKX, and Flex and the next day except for the Flex a new breed of vehicles both in design and technology. It's no excuse but it happened. 

 

 

Per Consumer Reports, the rate of problems for 2017 MKX is about on par with the 2016.  So, its not related to the early teething problems - its the fundamental design of the vehicle (which, btw, is not to say that it won't improve during the model run).  

 

The MKC, which has been in production for a longer period, has an abysmal reliability record. 

 

I will say, anecdotally that I have been soundly unimpressed by the build quality on the MKC, MKZ, and MKTs I had as loaners.  Every single one of those cars had at least one trim piece that was loose, broken, or otherwise compromised.  In fact, I've never seen that kind of consistent poor QC in any line of cars I've ever driven. And, again, as a brand, Lincoln had an atrocious reliability record over the last three years. 

[elijahbird7]

My '14 MKX was never taken to the dealer for anything but oil changes. My '16 has been back far too many times for different reasons. But, regardless, I still love the '16 style, 2.7 engine, tech package, 22 way seats, 21" Polished Wheels, adjustable suspension, trailer tow, Revel system, etc. I suppose if I weren't retired, going back to the dealer so many times would likely have been more of an issue. Lincoln only dealer, so interesting loaners including a Continental and a 400 HP MKZ. I will still buy a Lincoln next time I decide to trade anyway.

[akirby]

I think the platform is partly to blame. Fusion went from flawless (06-12 Mazda based CD3) to terrible for the 2013 model (Euro EUCD based CD4). Escape/MKC did the same moving to the Euro Kuga C platform. I think Edge/MKX has the same issue. Not to say that the factory itself doesn’t have its own issues, but Hermosillo where Fusion/MKZ is built certainly wasn’t to blame.

[walkabout]

It's a shame, because I still maintain that the drivers experience is in part with vehicles costing thousands more. The mkx is an absolute pleasure to drive.

[Grillmaster75]

there is a lot that can be read into any third party rating system.  input directly from owners is what I look at as most relevant, I like Edmunds.  For me I am disappointed in the overall quality.  I bought it #1, for the ride, #2 ease of use of controls and #3 the Revel sound system.  Acura MDX was what I thought I was going to buy but for me it didn't ride as nice, controls with the dual screens was not a plus and the sound system was not even in the same sip code as the MKX.   I was worried I was rolling the dice with Ford quality and longevity as I keep cars to 150,000.  To date I have had both rear windows fixed because on their own they would drop down and would not go back up unless you turned the car off.  this from week one.  One was due to a bad solenoid the other was pinched wiring.  there is a whole back story to how badly service handled this, including returning the car with the door panel not entirely put back in place, but quality of the service department is not the cars fault.  Next was the peeling wheels issue , another topic on this forum.  Next was both rear tail light assemblies came loose and needed to be replaced.  Literally the point of the taillight on the side quarter panel was sticking out.  at the same time the left front bumper assembly came loose - same story; broken clips, - replace the clips though there was a time they thought the entire front bumper might need to be replaced.  again there are interesting back stories as how they couldn't find my car on the lot, never completed the oil change etc.  it got so bad the owner of the dealership gave me a $100 gift card.  Great people who I am in contact with but they have lots of issues running there service department and the actual service people aren't good in my opinion.  Another minor issues trailer hitch could have been installed differently, but that didn't bother me.

 

If the problems are cosmetic and not mechanical and they don't kill me with a thousand cuts I am ok with the MKX.  Its ride is top shelf, even with 29,000 miles on the tires. the info system, like all systems could improve, but still better than most that I have seen.

chris 

[Cosmos36]

Grillmaster/Chris...what was the production date of your MKX?

 

There's nothing like poor customer service to sour one's opinion of a vehicle brand, especially if the dealer is the only one in reasonable proximity to you. Your MKX appears to have suffered some assembly and/or materiel issues during its production. I continue to hope that LiMoCo has resolved such problems.

[walkabout]

Chris- Crappy service is another complaint. I used to take my vehicle to a dealer nearby (Star Ford /Lincoln). They often did more damage them I brought the car in for to start.

[Grillmaster75]

Grillmaster/Chris...what was the production date of your MKX?

 

There's nothing like poor customer service to sour one's opinion of a vehicle brand, especially if the dealer is the only one in reasonable proximity to you. Your MKX appears to have suffered some assembly and/or materiel issues during its production. I continue to hope that LiMoCo has resolved such problems.

 

not sure what the production date is, but if it on the sticker on the drivers side jam then 2-16 - my birthday!.  I can tell you that I took ownership May of 2016.  started looking in February of 2016 and the car was on the showroom floor.  Anymore falling apart issues and I might go straight to Lincoln just because.  I have everything documented, including some interesting conversations with the body shop.  But let me re-iterate - I love driving the car. Prior car and service experience was a MB E350.  night and day based on the quality of work and none of these falling apart issues.  

Chris 

[akirby]

You do understand that you can use any dealer for warranty work and service - you don't have to take it back to where you bought it.

[Grillmaster75]

You do understand that you can use any dealer for warranty work and service - you don't have to take it back to where you bought it.

 

yea, but it is super convenient.  Because I've talked with every level of manager and the owner they know me.  I hope that is worth something when the time comes to dicker over a cost for a service.  when I had the MB and the warranty ran out I found a local German service center and saved 20-30% off dealer services like brakes. I was skeptical at first but basically they all drove MB's and BMW's and said they have the same equipment as the dealer just less choices of coffee and soda (:-).  there are more and more independent firms popping up who claim to be able to service American cars.  time will tell, and I haven't given up hope on the MKX or the dealer.  

Chris 

[akirby]

I would argue that it's not very convenient if they can't fix the problem correctly and cause more issues with each visit.

 

I have a great salesperson at the local dealer who knows me.  I just call and tell him what I want and he gets it one way or the other.  He knows I use X plan.   But their service department screwed up twice in a row so now I refuse to do business with them.  

 

It's like my wife's grandmother used to say about her Curtis Mathes tv.   After it died for the 5th time and they came out and fixed it I asked her why she kept buying Curtis Mathes tvs?   She said because when they break they come out to the house and fix it.   I said well what if you bought a different brand that never failed in the first place?   It took her a few minutes to get it.

[walkabout]

I know we disagree about this akirby (which is OK) but the lack of control Ford has over Lincoln dealers is part of the problem here.  Few people walk away from a Lexus or Infiniti dealer with these complaints.   One way or another, other companies maintain a much higher standard of customer support than Lincoln. Even the most arrogant of all companies, BMW, was a thousand times better to me than Lincoln. 

 

There are only TWO LIncoln dealers that are reasonably close to me (despite the fact that I live in the biggest car market in the country).  The first one kept my car for eight days without doing any work because they had a problem with a service adviser.  Eight days, while I paid on the lease.  I kept calling and calling and they wouldn't even return my calls or give me my vehicle back.

 

The second dealer has repeatedly broken parts of my car when taking for service.  The first time, they declared my Sync 3 needed to be replaced (which I still don't believe). They returned the vehicle with all USB ports deactivated and the front console with a nice gorge in it . In other words, vehicle came back in worse shape then in went in.  Second time, glove compartment kept spontaneously opening because plastic trim on dash failed.  After three separate trips (because they continued to argue the problems were caused by me kicking the glovebox out of alignment - something I somehow managed to do while sitting in the driver's seat), they finally replaced the plastic trim.  However, they cracked the wood trim on the console in three different places. They actually returned the car to me with multiple cracks in the wood. 

 

The above is not just bad dealer service. It grossly incompetent, reprehensible service.  Its embarrassing, especially to a brand that considers itself upscale. 

 

My take on the MKX remains the same.  On road, I still see it as one of the best (and maybe even the best) vehicle in the class.  I think Sync 3 IS the best infortainment system in the segment.  But, the materials quality and fit and finish are a bummer, the reliability questionable, and the dealer service is an unmitigated joke.  Lincoln got the hard parts correct, and then dropped the ball on the easier challenges. 

Edited November 2, 2017 by walkabout

[akirby]

I know we disagree about this akirby (which is OK) but the lack of control Ford has over Lincoln dealers is part of the problem here.  Few people walk away from a Lexus or Infiniti dealer with these complaints.   One way or another, other companies maintain a much higher standard of customer support than Lincoln. Even the most arrogant of all companies, BMW, was a thousand times better to me than Lincoln. 

 

I don’t disagree that there is room for improvement with Lincoln corporate customer service. I’ve said that repeatedly.

 

Lexus, Acura and Infinit did not exist until the late 80s. Most Ford/Lincoln franchises date back to the 70s, 60s or even 50s and those franchise agreements did not anticipate the current luxury vehicle dealer experience. There are also far more Lincoln dealers than Lexus dealers.

 

I’ve often said Ford would have been better off to kill Lincoln and create a new brand with a new franchise agreement, new showrooms, etc.

[Grillmaster75]

I would argue that it's not very convenient if they can't fix the problem correctly and cause more issues with each visit.

 

I have a great salesperson at the local dealer who knows me.  I just call and tell him what I want and he gets it one way or the other.  He knows I use X plan.   But their service department screwed up twice in a row so now I refuse to do business with them.  

 

It's like my wife's grandmother used to say about her Curtis Mathes tv.   After it died for the 5th time and they came out and fixed it I asked her why she kept buying Curtis Mathes tvs?   She said because when they break they come out to the house and fix it.   I said well what if you bought a different brand that never failed in the first place?   It took her a few minutes to get it.

 

Some good points to ponder for sure, thanks.  I too had a Curtis Mathes (never broke).  Like I said as long as the MKX is fixed under warranty I have had patience  with the work being done.  I won't be any longer.  I thought for the knowledge of the forum I would post my experiences.  For what it is worth I used to lease cars for my business and I have personally owned 17 cars.  Loved leasing because after 2 or 3 years tops you got rid of the car, good bad or indifferent.  I only kept one car - an Accord which I sold to my daughter.  But I kept the MB for 157,000 miles so that says a lot about the quality and reliability of that car. 

Chris

[Grillmaster75]

W

 

I know we disagree about this akirby (which is OK) but the lack of control Ford has over Lincoln dealers is part of the problem here.  Few people walk away from a Lexus or Infiniti dealer with these complaints.   One way or another, other companies maintain a much higher standard of customer support than Lincoln. Even the most arrogant of all companies, BMW, was a thousand times better to me than Lincoln. 

 

There are only TWO LIncoln dealers that are reasonably close to me (despite the fact that I live in the biggest car market in the country).  The first one kept my car for eight days without doing any work because they had a problem with a service adviser.  Eight days, while I paid on the lease.  I kept calling and calling and they wouldn't even return my calls or give me my vehicle back.

 

The second dealer has repeatedly broken parts of my car when taking for service.  The first time, they declared my Sync 3 needed to be replaced (which I still don't believe). They returned the vehicle with all USB ports deactivated and the front console with a nice gorge in it . In other words, vehicle came back in worse shape then in went in.  Second time, glove compartment kept spontaneously opening because plastic trim on dash failed.  After three separate trips (because they continued to argue the problems were caused by me kicking the glovebox out of alignment - something I somehow managed to do while sitting in the driver's seat), they finally replaced the plastic trim.  However, they cracked the wood trim on the console in three different places. They actually returned the car to me with multiple cracks in the wood. 

 

The above is not just bad dealer service. It grossly incompetent, reprehensible service.  Its embarrassing, especially to a brand that considers itself upscale. 

 

My take on the MKX remains the same.  On road, I still see it as one of the best (and maybe even the best) vehicle in the class.  I think Sync 3 IS the best infortainment system in the segment.  But, the materials quality and fit and finish are a bummer, the reliability questionable, and the dealer service is an unmitigated joke.  Lincoln got the hard parts correct, and then dropped the ball on the easier challenges. 

 

WOW - thanks for making me feel better about my experience, not good for you though.  overall I agree with your post.  Other than eventually fixing all of the issues without further damage to the car I can add one positive experience.  my LGV20 would most of the time not sync with the MKX.  They spent hours trying to get it to sync over a couple of visits. when it did sync it then wouldn't sync a day or two later.  one of those is it the car or the phone? I finally found someone with a V20 at the dealer that synced up no problem.  At the same time I went to Verizon and got a rep with a V20 to sync his phone.  Ultimately Verizon determined the phone was the problem and we replaced the phone no charge and no problems since.  That is the extra mile the "managers" put in trying to fix a problem.  But the way they let the car be delivered when a service is completed is as poor as anything I have seen.   Same positive story for the Lincoln on line support when trying to upgrade the original sync system (I ran the last update and it went flawlessly).  Super helpful. 

[Cosmos36]

The Lincoln dealers in China are a model of what I would like to see in the U.S.

[fredluke]

The Lincoln dealers in China are a model of what I would like to see in the U.S.

 

Yes..the production is continually increasing to China form the plant. Fortunately, China drives on the RHS so tooling is not an issue, but the MKX cannot be shipped to Hong Kong which is a huge luxury car market (LHS)

[Cosmos36]

Perhaps the Hong Kong issue will be resolved when an exclusive new Lincoln SUV, likely modeled after something resembling a Navigator, is built by joint venture partner Changan Automobile Group in China in 2019.

 

Lincoln's are increasingly popular in China. I can drive a short distance from my home to view 4,000+ Lincolns (MKZ, MKC, MKX, Navi, Conti) being loaded for export from Port of Portland monthly. It's probably not commonly known, but China is currently exporting limited models of Buick, Cadillac, Volvo (owned by China's Geely), and Ford (Focus in 2019) to the U.S.

Edited November 7, 2017 by Cosmos36

[fredluke]

Some Cadys are built in China?  Wow... thought I'd never see that! I sometimes wonder how strange things have come...

 

Cady built in China

Hyundai built in US

Honda built in Canada US

Chryslers built in China

 

Everything is backwards!!

[Cosmos36]

Re: Cadillac built in China, it's the CT6 plug-in, a 2.0L turbo hybrid starting at $75,095.

[NOTMY911]

...  Hyundai built in US...

 

 

They were stamping/assembling in Canada in the late 80's.  They spend over 300's of million to build a factory in Bromont Quebec, they were my neighbour.

 

It closed after 4 years...  The building was quite impressive.  

 

http://www.autonews.com/article/19940328/ANA/403280711/hyundai-shutters-2-canada-plants-840-workers-at-bromont-let-go

 

http://www.langleyhyundai.com/history-hyundai-canada/

[fredluke]

They were stamping/assembling in Canada in the late 80's.  They spend over 300's of million to build a factory in Bromont Quebec, they were my neighbour.

 

It closed after 4 years...  The building was quite impressive.  

 

http://www.autonews.com/article/19940328/ANA/403280711/hyundai-shutters-2-canada-plants-840-workers-at-bromont-let-go

 

http://www.langleyhyundai.com/history-hyundai-canada/

 

 

Interesting links...Auto landscape is changing so quickly the only way to know for sure where a vehicle is built is to look at the door jamb.

[Cosmos36]

And...auto industry analysts, ex-manufacturing CEOs, auto media musings, etc. are forecasting that private vehicle ownership will be entirely replaced by on-demand autonomous transportation modes in the next 12-15 years. If so, an era is closing for many folks. Anyone for a pilotless flight to Hawaii?