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2016 Lincoln MKX Excessive Road Noise


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77 replies to this topic

#1 OFFLINE   Rick65inlosangeles

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Posted 30 April 2016 - 09:35 PM

MKX road generated noise vs exterior free air noise.

 

One of the problems I found with recent Lincoln vehicles especially the MKX series vs older Lincoln’s (Mark VII & VIII and Town Cars) is the fact that the MKX does a fine job of eliminating outside sounds (at least mine) such as free air sounds (traffic & wind). The new laminated glass in the side windows has helped this.  But my biggest complaint is the amount of road generated noise that is transferred to the vehicle from the tires.  This is especially a problem for us owners of low-profile tires as the sidewall is just too short to help absorbed some of the road roughness that transfers to the body as road noise.  Older Lincoln vehicles used massive amounts of mastic and padding under the carpet to insulation and contain this body noise.

 

The designers at Ford Motor Company did a fine job on the design and execution of our vehicles. But then the bean counters got involved as to where to cut costs.  If you take a look at the carpets in our vehicles its just thin and cheap and so is the thin padding underneath.  I’ve seen apartment grade carpeting that’s of better quality. Under the carpet and padding is the floor pan and Ford did apply mastic in some areas to help control the resonance in the steel, but it’s just too little to do a minimum amount of sound control.

 

A couple of weeks ago I removed the front seat, carpets, and Styrofoam inserts and lined the floor pan with a product called Dynamat. www.dynamat.com You cut the sections and then remove the paper backing and the Dynamat sticks to the floor pan. I then replaced the Styrofoam inserts and over this I applied a product called Dynapad.  Dynamat stops resonance and Dynapad stops sound. Dynapad is 3/8" four layer composite sound barrier. I then replaced the carpets and seats.

 

I would say there’s 75-80 percent less noise now. I’ve only done the areas in the toe board and under the front seats but I plan on doing the rear carpet area, under the rear seat and cargo area.

 

Now if “The Lincoln Motor Company” would only spend a few more dollars per vehicle to contain the road noise we could all say once again, “Lincoln, What a Luxury Car Should Be”.

 

This is the first time in the past nine months that I’m really starting to enjoy this vehicle.

 

Finally got around to getting some photos for all you to see.

Attached Files


Edited by Rick65inlosangeles, 03 June 2016 - 12:31 PM.

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#2 OFFLINE   thisguy159

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Posted 01 May 2016 - 06:38 AM

I do not believe this is a none issue...the mkx routinely tests as the quitest vehicle in the class exceeding Lexus and alike. All turn down your hearing aids!!!

#3 ONLINE   akirby

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Posted 01 May 2016 - 11:23 AM

Maybe it's your roads? We have a reserve with the optional 21" wheels and there is absolutely no road noise whatsoever.

#4 OFFLINE   Rick65inlosangeles

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Posted 01 May 2016 - 07:26 PM

Since I don't wear hearing aids I don't need to turn them down.  With the changes, I've been able to turn down the audio system.

 

The roads here in Los Angeles are crap when it comes to patches and ruts. The elevated area at the end of the 105 freeway near LAX is really loud.  I've driven this same road with my '86 Mark VII and with the amount of soundproofing that Lincoln put in that car would make it far superior to any car on the road today.  Even a friends '89 Lincoln Town Car is quieter than an MKX.



#5 OFFLINE   thisguy159

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Posted 01 May 2016 - 08:54 PM

I don't doubt that the modification you made help and if you had some pics and direction I may even try that on mine. That said I live in Chicago and I would bet with winters and snow plows we have our roads would be worse. If you are experiencing that much noise there is something wrong with your car or the frequency your new tires have on the roads you travel just don't match up well. Also saying that anybodys 80's or 90's Ford GM or Chrysler product is in any way quieter then mkx is laughable..sorry, especially a towncar with a live axle and architecture dating back to the 60's. I had an acura prior to the mkx with 17 in wheels and depending on the expressway especially 88 there were parts where you would hear a definite drum from the wheels but that was the road not the car.

Edited by thisguy159, 02 May 2016 - 05:24 AM.


#6 OFFLINE   Cosmos36

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Posted 01 May 2016 - 09:49 PM

thisguy...off topic perhaps, but I was born in Chicago (Oak Park). I can hardly contain the joy that I've known for many decades that I've lived elsewhere, especially the 54 years I've lived at various west coast locations in coastal Oregon-Washington & Northern California (Mother Lode country). It all started with a Navy billet flying out of NAS Whidbey Island WA and ended with a professional career retirement in western Oregon where traffic gridlock is jokingly referred to as 'three deer in the middle of the road'.

 

Sorry to digress.



#7 OFFLINE   thisguy159

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Posted 02 May 2016 - 05:33 AM

I like oak park, I grew up in Schaumburg and now am in the Western suburbs. I hate Illinois though, I want to get out of Dodge daily but my wife won't let me especially with a new born and having family around. It is seriously the worst state in the Union, politics suck, weather sucks, taxes suck, cost of leaving sucks, proximity to any other major metropolitan area sucks, roads sick, traffic sucks. The only good thing about IL is beautiful Chicago but that is for only about 3 weeks in between spring or whatever we have here and fall.
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#8 OFFLINE   jrdad

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Posted 02 June 2016 - 08:06 PM

  I have about 600 miles on an MKX Select Plus.

  The road noise is awful. I have a 2010 F150 and an old 2004 Explorer with less road noise.
  I have been on a few roads that sound very quiet but they were usually smooth asphalt roads. The vast majority of the roads in my area are concrete with a textured surface. Some are grooved, some wavy lines, some just a roughened surface. This produces a rumble that changes with the road surface texture. The more aggressive the texture the louder the rumble.
  There are about 15 miles of I-35 going South from Gainesville, TX that is so loud you want ear plugs. The road is undoubtedly bad but I have never heard it so loud in a vehicle, ever!

  The dealer is absolutely no help. Their answer was "It sounds like the rest of the new cars".
  I asked them to check the Active Noise Control was actually working. Their answer was "We don't have a way to test it", "It sounds like the rest of the cars". I'm not impressed by their technicians abilities nor their subjective way of testing for road noise.
  The dealer is in a new part of another town and the roads are relatively smooth so they don't hear it. It's there but at a very low level on their roads.
  I like everything about this car except for the road noise.

  By the time my relatives and friends ride in this car there will be maybe 200 people that by experience or word of mouth who will never buy a Lincoln.

  I got a Select Plus because I don't have any head room with the sun roof required for any of the higher range models. I read in one of the Lincoln advertisements they put extra sound deadening in the top models. It was a mistake to leave it out of the others.
  I may resort to adding sound proofing materials to the floor as another forum member has done.


Edited by jrdad, 03 June 2016 - 03:11 PM.


#9 ONLINE   akirby

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Posted 02 June 2016 - 08:54 PM

Reserve is the highest trim not the lowest. Are you sure yours is supposed to have ANC?

#10 OFFLINE   Cosmos36

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Posted 02 June 2016 - 09:13 PM

jrdad...welcome to the forum.

 

I was also disappointed with the road noise feedback of the MKX. I have the 18" wheels which I had hoped would mitigate some of the road noise I've experienced with low profile tires on my other vehicles, but to no avail. I would assume that you've read post #1 of this thread which provides a partial answer for the DIYer. IIRC, you are correct that the MKX top-of-the-line Black Label (BL) models may have added insulation, but I suspect all other models in the MKX hierarchy (Premier, Select-Select Plus, and Reserve) are all the same/similar as my Select Plus.

 

Looking forward, if I am to remain a Lincoln customer, it will be a requisite that Lincoln improve the road noise scenario.

 

BTW, I am not familiar with a Reserve Plus model. You appear to relegate such an MKX to a lower status than the "higher range models". Other than the BL models, Reserve is the highest model.


Edited by Cosmos36, 02 June 2016 - 09:14 PM.


#11 OFFLINE   Cosmos36

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Posted 02 June 2016 - 09:20 PM

Isn't ANC standard on all models or are the Lincoln brochures & order guides wrong?



#12 ONLINE   akirby

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Posted 03 June 2016 - 12:05 AM

Isn't ANC standard on all models or are the Lincoln brochures & order guides wrong?

 

I didn't have the order guide handy when I asked but it appears it is supposed to be standard on all models.

 

Either it's not working or those 18" tires are really bad or your roads are terrible.

 

Our Reserve is as quiet as a bank vault with no road noise whatsoever.  But most of our roads are in pretty good shape.



#13 OFFLINE   thisguy159

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Posted 03 June 2016 - 08:56 AM

I'm curious to find out if anybody that has a complaint about road noise goes to test drive another MKX over the same roads they have problem with.  I can say that I have driven model with 18 in wheels (Michelins) which are not low profile and my reserve which has 20 (Kumho) in low profile tires to my surprise both were similarly quit and both have similar ride which is a surprise because a high profile skinnier tire should give me less road noise and better ride...so kudos to Lincoln there.

 

Of note not that this is something anybody would want to do when they get a new vehicle but your last resort would be to switch tires which will make a BIG difference in how your car drives and sounds.  Kumho from what I hear that are on our car i guess are not the best, again no problem here, but there is a yokahama tire that is about 150 for the 20 in wheels that is supposed to be much better.   Go to tire rack and see which get the best rating for sound.



#14 OFFLINE   enigma-2

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Posted 03 June 2016 - 10:01 AM

Tires have a huge influence of how much road noise is generated inside the vehicle.

I drove a new MKX last week and it was very quiet. Had Korean tires.

My MKX has Bridgestone's with about 35-40,000 miles, and are still relatively quiet.

I had Michelin's on a previous car that were very quiet for the first 20,000 miles and then the soft rubber wore off and became "extremely" noisy as the harder rubber took over. (Took them back to the local Michelin dealer and he told me that's how they got the 60k rating.)

My initial guess is it's your tires causing the problem. What tires do you have on your MKX?

Edited by enigma-2, 03 June 2016 - 10:04 AM.


#15 OFFLINE   shoeguy

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Posted 03 June 2016 - 10:19 AM

Tires have a huge influence of how much road noise is generated inside the vehicle.

I drove a new MKX last week and it was very quiet. Had Korean tires.

My MKX has Bridgestone's with about 35-40,000 miles, and are still relatively quiet.

I had Michelin's on a previous car that were very quiet for the first 20,000 miles and then the soft rubber wore off and became "extremely" noisy as the harder rubber took over. (Took them back to the local Michelin dealer and he told me that's how they got the 60k rating.)

My initial guess is it's your tires causing the problem. What tires do you have on your MKX?

 

Absolutely, tires must be the issue here . On a surprising note , my reserve with 20s have Hankook tires , and I was none to pleased when I took delivery of this car. As I had a 2009 Flex with Hankook 19s and had them off after 2000 k. These were the worst tires for both noise as well as comfort of ride. The Hankook that are on my MKX are very quiet as well as nice riding . Bottom line a very pleasant surprise.



#16 OFFLINE   enigma-2

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Posted 03 June 2016 - 11:38 AM

Yea that was the the name, that's tires that were on the MKX I drove last week. Very quiet. I was very surprised, they seemed to have made great strides in their tires.

#17 OFFLINE   Cosmos36

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Posted 03 June 2016 - 12:21 PM

In my experience with road noise, it is no-brainer simple to assign cause between blaming the tires vis-à-vis blaming the pavement. The road noise I refer to is clearly related to the age, type & quality of the road surface. My MKX riding on 18" Michelin Premier LTX rubber is bank-vault quiet on new dense-graded friction course asphalt pavement but very noisy on both new or worn open-graded asphalt. In either type of construction, the asphalt binder may be identical, but the mineral aggregate/matrix, e.g. coarse gravel vs finely crushed basalt, will determine smoothness. You would prefer to roller skate on one surface and avoid the other and the latter will cause greater road noise in a vehicle.

 

There are, of course, other factors that contribute to road noise...tires, suspension design, internal vehicle acoustics, insulation variables, etc. With respect to tires, some folks conflate road noise and ride quality, i.e. they don't distinguish between the two. My Kumho tires (on another vehicle) offer bone-jarring ride quality but are as quiet as the Michelin & Goodyear tires on my other vehicles regardless of road surface. IMO, Lincoln was stingy with cabin insulation for a vehicle in this price range.



#18 OFFLINE   jrdad

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Posted 03 June 2016 - 03:07 PM

  My apologies, I have a Select Plus MKX. I have edited my post above to reflect that.

 

  I have 18" Michelin Premium LTX tires. Michelin has always been a quiet tire for me with a soft ride. I don't believe that is the issue.

  Many of the streets around this town are relatively old and I have noticed the concrete has worn away on many streets and it exposes the aggregate. It's a bit like traveling on a cobblestone road but they really are stones embedded in the concrete. If you have ever ridden on a cobblestone road you know what I mean. It creates a rumble in the cabin constantly. Textured concrete is as bad or worse in some cases.

  I understand the Active Noise Control is on all models.



#19 OFFLINE   jrdad

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Posted 12 July 2016 - 08:38 PM

After listening to my MKX rumble around the local streets, I couldn't stand it any more and just gave in and took it to the local Audio Pros shop.

We pulled back the carpet in the back of the car and there was no sound dampening material to speak of in the entire back of the vehicle. There was none at all under the back seats either. Lincoln used a very cheap and thin carpet on top of the painted metal in the hatch area.

I asked the Audio Pros guy to put in sound deadening material under the back seats and go all the way to the back bumper. He suggested going up the quarter panels but I resisted the impulse and had only the floor area done.

I got the car back today and it sounds like a totally different car. I think I got rid of at least 50% of the road noise. The car sounds more solid. It sounds more like the big Lincolns did back when they made big quiet cars.

It sounds more like the car Lincoln should be selling.

I can now tell there is noise coming from the front of the car and I may decide in a few weeks to put sound deadening material up front to finish the project. Right now I'm finally enjoying my new car.

I will attach 2 photos showing the work done in the back of this car.Attached File  IMG_5211 (Medium).JPG   132.87KB   0 downloadsAttached File  IMG_5212 (Medium).JPG   167.85KB   0 downloads


Edited by jrdad, 12 July 2016 - 08:45 PM.


#20 OFFLINE   shoeguy

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Posted 12 July 2016 - 08:47 PM

Out of curiosity, how much did this cost you ? As I have been considering having much the same done as well. Just have not looked deeper into it so far.






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